Beta testing is really depressing.
When you put as much time into a project as Kingcom and I have, you start to feel like you’ve produced something pretty great. Thankfully, our beta testers have been there to keep us from drifting into the clouds. We’ve been brought crashing back to the ground, but this is all to your benefit. I don’t mean to say that the game has been a complete mess, certainly the work we put into it up until now has paid off. As a result, our beta testers have been able to isolate bugs and help us to improve the text. Above all else, this process has reminded me just how important it is to test the game properly. Despite my efforts to test the game, there were some crashes that I had missed and some textual mistakes I had read right over. But we’re finding them and we’re fixing them thanks to the beta testers.
Unfortunately, we have some bad news to announce. No, the project isn’t canceled. No, the release isn’t being pushed back 30 years. However, it is looking like we may have to disable the wireless multiplayer in the patched version of the game. Please understand that after all the effort we put into making this game as perfect as possible, nothing frustrates us more than the possibility of having to do something like this. Although I said disable, know that it will still be included in the game. If you really want to try it in spite of knowing the consequences, it will be possible. Here’s the deal… According to the testing we’ve done, playing the patched game with both the original Japanese game or the patch results in unpredictable crashes during dialogue. Battle seems to work just fine, but it’s almost impossible to make any progress in the game while using wireless mode. There are some other minor issues regarding item boxes and search points, but those aren’t crashes. You might be wondering why we can’t fix these problems like we’re fixing others. Unfortunately, no DS emulator supports wireless play, so we have no way of debugging the issues. Without debugging, we would have no idea where to start fixing them. Unless we get access to a DS devkit (and that will never happen), we can’t do anything about these issues.
We realize that for most of you, this will make absolutely no difference whatsoever. 99% of you probably never intended to play the game using wireless multiplayer (if you even knew the game had it). As perfectionistic as Kingcom and I are, we aren’t going to put the entire project on hold for years while we wait for emulator that would allow us to fix this. That is why we feel that disabling the wireless is the best course of action. It will allow us to present the full game as we intended but will still allow access to that broken extra for those who really want it. Oh, and for those of you who know more about the game, the Versus style WILL be available in-game without using the wireless mode. This isn’t the perfect solution. There is no perfect solution. We’re doing the best we can with the hand we’ve been dealt. If and when it becomes possible to emulate DS wireless, we intend to release an updated patch that gets it working as intended, but understand that could be years from now. I apologize that it had to come to this, but I hope you understand.
What do you think the best solution is? Some of the options we considered:
- Disable the wireless (allowing access with a code)
- Leave the wireless as-is and add extra warnings in-game
- Disable wireless completely
First of all, just gonna say that I’m glad the beta testing is progressing well and I hope you guys can get all the bugs worked out properly. As for the wireless gameplay, if the problems it presents don’t affect any other aspects of the game like the single player or versus like your post seems to say they don’t, then I don’t see any reason to disable the mode completely. I think leaving it as-is and putting a bunch of warnings in the game itself for anyone who still wants to try would be the best bet. Anyways, I’m sure you guys will work through all the problems and end up with a great final product. Good luck!
And maybe a Wireless with 2 patched rom ?
wow… this really shows the importance of beta testing. Concerning the multiplayer mode issue I think should do what neoalligator suggested and leave the multiplayer in with the warnings in case people who actually want to try it still can.
We had someone test wireless with two patched roms. The same issues were present between the two patched roms as between one patched rom and one Japanese rom. But yes, this is all certainly proof of just how important it is to test a patch extensively before releasing it.
Didn’t even know about the wireless play, but am still sorry there’s no easy way for you guys to fix it.
As for the options any of them work for me, whatever’s easier to implement.
If I had to pick, probably the 2nd.
Didn’t even know about the wireless play, but am still sorry there’s no easy way for you guys to fix it.
As for the options any of them work for me, whatever’s easier to implement.
If I had to pick, probably the 2nd.
I think the 2nd option is better. Me and my friends are fans of the Tales of games, and we can at least try.
Honestly….. who cares bout multiplayer…. I personally, bought the DS Lite from the day it came out, and Never used online play. RPGs, unless MMO, should be enjoyed single player, as they always have been enjoyed since times of old. So long as the game works, and there are no crashes during gameplay, I say disable the wireless and have fun doing it. The main thing is that the actual game works, as that what we’ll play for 99.9% of the time offline. Thanks for the good work, I’ve been following this since the beginning, and simply can’t wait to play this game, cause it looks awesome. We need a game like this during these times of like no videogame releases.
I say a combination between 1 and 2, disabling it with a code and give the warnings.
Perhaps you can give a more expanded explanation of the what the multi-player is about from the post I understand that you can acquire a new style but that is it.
I vote for option 2. If possible, add a popup warning or a reminder in a text box to appear when selecting the “Wireless Mode” option in the start menu.
I’ve been waiting for this for weeks, and I’m glad you guys finally updated us on the progress. I don’t mind having to wait, but regarding the wireless feature I say just leave it as-is. I’m just wondering if any ripped DS games with wireless features can work on a R4 (which I intend to use with this when you guys finally release it)
If it was originally programed into the game, I’m sure leaving it as is will result in less work (making the release sooner) instead of having to take the trouble of removing it would.
But whatever floats your boat(s) works. Extra features are nice but if you can’t… oh well. “Manure Occureth” (sh!t happens) they say.
Option 2 I’d say.
I didn’t even know the game supported wireless play. Take it out if it’s causing issues. SP > MP in this case.
Didn’t plan on playing multiplayer, but option two is the best way to go in my opinion. Thanks for all your work
I think you should just leave it disabled and let people who want it use the code to use it.
I just play Tales of games for the awesome plots, mutiplayer is a far after-thought.
I hope beta-testing finishes well, and I’m proud of you guys for working so hard on it. I am very excited to see this released. I hope theres isn’t anymore major bugs.
I wont use the wireless so, to me, it could be disabled;
but I think some people might want to give it a try, so maybe you could make some kind of cheat code to make this work.
you can’t go wrong with option 1
This is a Nintendo DS SDK that I found some time ago on http://www.x-cult.org. Maybe you should look into it, because you said you could maybe fix the issues when having a SDK?
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=HDPMGHWX
Nintendo DS SDK:
http:// http://www.megaupload.com/?d=HDPMGHWX
Maybe you should take a look at it? I was really looking forward to playing the game with my best friend, but I would also not be too disappointed if it doesn’t work.
Forgot the source; I found this SDK on http://www.x-cult.org in a thread about software development kits.
I would say, until there is a WiFi-Compatible NDS Emulator
# Disable the wireless (allowing access with a code)…
Then, if there will ever be a WiFi-Compatible Emulator, you could re-activate the wireless and release Patch 1.1 or 2.0 or something like that.
I would have wanted to play multiplayer but it seems it cant be helped =( Well gotta hope best for the actual single player experience.
Oh and I think that the 3 is best solution. And after you can fix the problem then release new patch. Theres no need to be unusable multiplayer.
I think the simplest way is the best, what you had done is great enough. Just don’t torture yourself with something that is still out of your grasp.
This way you don’t have to do something that you should doing years later
Check this out!
http://forums.ngemu.com/desmume-discussion/134329-impossible-just-happened-wfc-desmume.html
Is there a way to leave the wireless mode in jap to leave it bug free ?(supposing that the original version is bug free) but the rest of the game patched.
Since many tales players (myself included) really love the multiplayer battling, as it gets the series apart from the usual rpg’s.
If that isn’t possible, then I vote for number 1, since a cheat code will eventually be forgotten.
@Player594: Unfortunately, ToI uses ad hoc wireless for its multiplayer and that doesn’t work in this build of DeSmuME. Thank you for the suggestion though.
Well…here’s a useful note on emulators…
The current svn builds of DeSmuMe demonstrate some wireless capability. They may get that fully operational by the 0.96 or 0.97 release.
Doh! A few posts too late…Well…
Here’s a link for the latest builds:
http://www.emucr.com/search/label/NDS/
I’d go for option two. Although you should do whatever’s easiest, because most people probably don’t care much about the multiplayer.
I say just get rid of wireless altogether…. I don’t think anyone really uses that anyway, and if someone REALLY wanted to use it they’d just get a clean ROM of the game anyway.
Anything’s fine, as long as the game is released as bug-free as possible, I don’t care how you deal with the wireless issue.
My vote goes to:
3.Disable wireless completely
because:
the game isnt based on the wireless anyways, as you said yourself, 99% of the people dont even care, would you trouble 99% of the people to help 1% of the people ?
no.
Its really nice of you that you think of the other people to, but 100% perfection is not always possible (besides, no wireless = 100% perfection for many people too)
I love your TOI Project,
Good luck with the Beta Testing
Great job so far
Greets
Truthfully the wireless is not needed, especially if it’s such a pain in the ass might as well just ditch it and work on just the game itself, so i’m going with option 3.
It’s not a big disappointment for me… It just means we won’t be able to play multiplayer, that won’t stop me or my friends or my family from enjoying the game when the translation patch is completed… Which is hopefully soon…
@throughhim413
what do you think about the tales of hearts? would they have the same problem with ad hoc wifi when they are finished with their patch? or not?
ps
sorry for my language, my english is not good?
those two suits me
1. Disable the wireless (allowing access with a code)
2. Leave the wireless as-is and add extra warnings in-game
add-on to #2 maybe add extra warnings prior to downloading the patch too.
another options would be using the jp game with the patched game’s save file but then if it’s a first playthrough we’d miss some important plot unless we speak japanese lol.
I mean; we still can level up or play for fun and quit wireless once we want to continue main story, no? that would be good enough for me.
Get rid of the wireless all together, I doubt anyone will actually care.
1. Disable the wireless (allowing access with a code)
maybe someone can come up with something before a new emulator comes out!
I have a group of friends (3 People all together) that like tales games and we actually played all through Symphonia and Abyss multiplayer through the whole game. Since we all have a ds with flashcarts and since I discovered this project we were eagerly awaiting this patch so we could play Innocence in English with multiplayer. It’s defiantly sad to see such news after all the waiting and such. I’d say option 2 and hopefully their will be a way to fix this issue in the future. After reading over a few of the comments here and elsewhere it’s easy to say that it isn’t only 1% of the fanbase that enjoys Tales multiplayer and wish to play the game with friends. Please if there is ever a solution to this problem release an updated patch with multiplayer capabilities. Again thank you for your hard work on this patch and even if it’s single player only I’m sure it’ll be really enjoyable.
I lean towards disabling wireless mode completely. Once someone has played the single player game in English, they can get two Japanese versions and play in wireless then.
3-
You make it very clear that your intent is to release a polished localization, and allowing access to a mode of play that you describe as being buggy and boardering on unplayable simply takes away from the integrity of the localization as a whole.
If it doesnt work, cut it.
What Kamuki said (almost frightningly exactly describes my situation
). So yeah I’m also all for option 2. Also, it not like the other folks HAVE to play the “risky” multiplayer. Leaving it in with or without warning gives everyone his/her own choice…
I’m in the same boat with hatake and Kamuki LOL
I’d like the option available with a warning that the game might crash or disabled but possible to unlock with a code.
I guess the best ( and maybe less tyring ) way is to release 2 patches, one with multi disabled, and another one with multi enabled, uh?
Second option, for sure.
But this sucks. I was planning on playing through with a friend or two.
Either 1 or 2 would be best. That leaves it open for those who want to try it. And lets potential emu developers use the patched game as a test bed for a wireless component add-on.
I’d say option 2
There is no point in wasting the time disabling a feature like that. Just inform people that “Hey, this’ll probably crash…but if you wanna have a go at it…”
It’s not like I know tons of Tales fans who own flashcarts(0 actually) and I doubt many people were in a situation to use the wireless play anyway(or if they were, with siblings I would assume), but there’s no harm in leaving it in as long as you have the proper warnings in place.
Personnaly I don’t really care about wireless play, the only reason I use wireless play is to get the Versus style and since you already add it into your patch I don’t have any use of the wireless play
BTW thx for doing this for all tales fans who can’t play it b’coz of the language barrier. Salute
You should disable it. I don’t think many of us will play with it, but those who do are just going to have to live with it. Since DS emulators haven’t progressed that far. I don’t think they ever will, so I think this would be best.
Many people are going to use flashcarts and would still like to give the multiplayer a try. So I don’t see any reason to disable it.